Og - Melech Habashan

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Permalink Reply by Tehachapi Torah Center on November 9, 2008 at 6:10pm

Og had plenty of offspring,
rephaim, zamzumim, eimim,
Sichon related?
Goliath from a desendent of Og, was it Ophra former step daughter of Naomi?
may still be some mixed genes in population from Og, just as Cain's desendent married Noah
why not 25% of Population?
because most were wiped out in wars (4 kings..) or seen as a threat due to size, personality types, or had some physical or mental handicaps that kept them from adapting.
Joshua/Calev got 4 that were left in Hevron
rmp

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Permalink Reply by Chaim on November 10, 2008 at 6:20pm

Somewhere I read, probably a midrash, that Sichon and Og were brothers or half-brothers, yet the midrash describing how Noach fed Og through the window of the ark doesn't mention Sichon.

There is a midrash (page 98 of The Midrash Says) that:
Cham's wife gave birth to Sichon while in the ark. In truth, Sichon had been fathered by Shamchazael (one of the angels who, before the mabul, descended to the earth to live there as human bieings). Cham came to his wife to save her face.


This continued the explanation of the 3 who procreated in the ark.

If Sichon was born in the ark from a perhaps adulterous union with Cham's wife, then he would be another source of giant genes.

To reconcile the half-brother issue we can deduce that Og came about through the same father?

It is still confusing why Sichon is not mentioned on leaving the ark.

How Cham's actions were intended to spare his wife's honor might be that he would have been believed to have fathered Sichon?

And perhaps if Cham's wife had been guilty of consenting to adulterous relations then maybe she would not have been permitted to Cham at all, and Canaan's status becomes further reduced? But the Torah still records Cham's wife as his wife, so presumably there was no mandatory divorce.

Perhaps we can deduce that Sichon was the spawn of rape or trickery (could be easier than Shalomit and the Egyptian assuming an angel taking on a body can more easily be an imposter even by day).

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Permalink Reply by Ron Balofsky on November 10, 2008 at 7:25pm

Adultery is not really an issue here as the people were not only not Jewish it was also pre-Torah. The Noahdite laws were also enacted post Arc.

Chaim said:

Somewhere I read, probably a midrash, that Sichon and Og were brothers or half-brothers, yet the midrash describing how Noach fed Og through the window of the ark doesn't mention Sichon.

There is a midrash (page 98 of The Midrash Says) that:
Cham's wife gave birth to Sichon while in the ark. In truth, Sichon had been fathered by Shamchazael (one of the angels who, before the mabul, descended to the earth to live there as human bieings). Cham came to his wife to save her face.


This continued the explanation of the 3 who procreated in the ark.

If Sichon was born in the ark from a perhaps adulterous union with Cham's wife, then he would be another source of giant genes.

To reconcile the half-brother issue we can deduce that Og came about through the same father?

It is still confusing why Sichon is not mentioned on leaving the ark.

How Cham's actions were intended to spare his wife's honor might be that he would have been believed to have fathered Sichon?

And perhaps if Cham's wife had been guilty of consenting to adulterous relations then maybe she would not have been permitted to Cham at all, and Canaan's status becomes further reduced? But the Torah still records Cham's wife as his wife, so presumably there was no mandatory divorce.

Perhaps we can deduce that Sichon was the spawn of rape or trickery (could be easier than Shalomit and the Egyptian assuming an angel taking on a body can more easily be an imposter even by day).

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